Strong Alibi wrote:That's true, to a sense, but when a band named "Our Lady Peace" sounds nothing today like a band named "Our Lady Peace" did from 1994–2001, usually you end up with people like us who can't shut up about it.
yeah but to be fair the OLP of 1994 sounded nothing like the OLP of 2001.. just the way the bands evolved, it's a pity that it seems to be heading further from your particular taste these days. and hey i'm all for constructive criticism.. just some of the negativity on here borders on disrespect ala that beason guys post on previous page. just seems to me that if some people hate the new OLP so much, don't listen to it and enjoy the old OLP and appreciate they put out those. but hey all about opinions i guess, probably easier for me since i am really loving the new album.
Explain disrespect. I'm not trying to disrespect anyone. And OLP is a band I grew up with so I have tried to like this album a lot, and have given it the time of the day more than I would with any other band...as I am sure many of you have. But when I step away for a second and say to myself..if any other band wrote AYD or White Flags...would I give it the time of day...and the answer is no.
I'm not going after anyone who likes the new album. Like it..love it.
Anyway looking at some peoples rankings. I'm pretty surprised how many people have Clumsy so high. I am sure it brings back a lot of memories and such, but as a full album, it has a lot of throw aways. The back half is loaded with some pretty bad tracks like Shaking, Hello Oskar, Let You DOwn, The Story of...I mean the good songs are very strong, but could never listen from start to finish.
Last edited by Beason52 on 7/24/2009, 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ok, i think the word disrespect is a bit strong but this was the area in your post that really irked me..
Beason52 wrote:Sure the song writing wasn't incredible, but it was their best stuff. Personally I think the band is so lost...if they think think this is a new beginning and one door has opened and the past has closed. This is really full circle from Gravity. All the progress from HIPT, even though it seems hated here, has been lost. It seems the band is so damn happy. I don't get it. They think writing a song like AYD and Never Get Over You by themselves is liberating? I mean can we all admit that is such BS. I generally believe the band isn't talking out of their mouths like most of them do with a new album. They generally believe this is a new day or era or what have you. That my friends is pretty messed up.
They just seem in such a happy place. Good for them, but this is some of the most generic music ever. The way they talk about being at that place where they couldn't care less how many records they sell. A band says that when they stop making top 40 hits and tries something out of the box that isn't mainstream and which truly make them happy. Not the other way around.
it just seems that because they haven't taken the direction that fits your expectations.. that the band is lost and that it's sad that they're happy with the music they are producing. just think instead of complaining about it you should just respect the fact they are doing what they want to do and accept its not to your taste and enjoy the past OLP albums you enjoyed instead. i don't really care if people say the album isnt so good as they don't enjoy the percussion/raines vocals/steves riffs.. cos thats constructive.. just calling them lost and pretty much wrong about liking what they're doing doesn't sit well with me.
on another note.. agree with you on clumsy, really don't see whats so good about it as a whole. individually it has supermans dead and car crash.. but as you say there did seem a bit of filler in the mix.
senseofurgency wrote:you just have to look at the setlists they're playing.. a real lack of happiness/sm going on.. fact is raine is no longer comfortable singing in a higher key often.. if raine was to attempt to sing the way that some of you want.. well.. the poor guy might not have a voice in 5 years time. its what age and touring does to you unfortunately. but i still think he has one of the most emotive and effective voices in music today. so i personally don't mind the progressive change. just wish some of you would stop expecting so much, but ah well.
I totally agree with you, it will probably always be up in the air whether or not raine actually can still sing those high octaves, but personally for the most part I don't believe that he can. If you think about it it's probably affected there creativity as well, since he can't play with the song structure vocally as much as he used to. If you listen to a lot of the live recordings there are songs that he for sure just cannot hit anymore. I mean I don't know how anyone can argue that, there are just songs he flat out cannot reach the notes. And I think that's why he doesn't sing the high stuff in studio anymore.. In that environment sure, I'm betting he can hit higher notes and use his falsetto more as well as get some tuning help to get it right, but I'm certain it wouldn't be easy for him anymore. And then he would be expected to take those songs out live and I have a feeling he just would not be able to do it. Even in the live recording of dreamland off the burn burn dvd you can tell he's off key a lot of the time, and those aren't even high notes. Basically what I'm trying to say is raines voice is absolutely not the same as it was when our lady peace began. When OLP wrote gravity raine was just entering his thirties. That's not terribly old but think about all the music they had performed before then? I mean they had four albums under there belt already and a lot of tours. And now its 9 years later and raines almost 40. You can't just disregard mileage like that, especially when raine was, for the most part, using a singing style (falsetto) that puts extra strain on the vocal chords.
He is more comfortable with some of the songs off earlier albums (and he can still sing some of them really well live like naveed, which i think is why they almost always play it) But overall he just can't reach those high notes like he used to consistently. You can literally hear his voice struggling when he sings on a lot of songs, not even just older ones. There are whole songs on youtube where you can tell he just can't get there. And I agree that if he tried to do more of those older songs live he would probably burn out his voice even faster. Did anyone see that interview he did where he was talking about something he used to do.. I don't remember what it was an exercise or something like that? But he was worried that it would ruin his voice so he stopped doing it..
gambit07 wrote:Did anyone see that interview he did where he was talking about something he used to do.. I don't remember what it was an exercise or something like that? But he was worried that it would ruin his voice so he stopped doing it..
It was Martial Arts. It didn't have to do with his voice really... He was just saying how a friend of his broke his jaw or something like that and can barely sing now.
senseofurgency wrote:you just have to look at the setlists they're playing.. a real lack of happiness/sm going on.. fact is raine is no longer comfortable singing in a higher key often.. if raine was to attempt to sing the way that some of you want.. well.. the poor guy might not have a voice in 5 years time. its what age and touring does to you unfortunately. but i still think he has one of the most emotive and effective voices in music today. so i personally don't mind the progressive change. just wish some of you would stop expecting so much, but ah well.
I totally agree with you, it will probably always be up in the air whether or not raine actually can still sing those high octaves, but personally for the most part I don't believe that he can. If you think about it it's probably affected there creativity as well, since he can't play with the song structure vocally as much as he used to. If you listen to a lot of the live recordings there are songs that he for sure just cannot hit anymore. I mean I don't know how anyone can argue that, there are just songs he flat out cannot reach the notes. And I think that's why he doesn't sing the high stuff in studio anymore.. In that environment sure, I'm betting he can hit higher notes and use his falsetto more as well as get some tuning help to get it right, but I'm certain it wouldn't be easy for him anymore. And then he would be expected to take those songs out live and I have a feeling he just would not be able to do it. Even in the live recording of dreamland off the burn burn dvd you can tell he's off key a lot of the time, and those aren't even high notes. Basically what I'm trying to say is raines voice is absolutely not the same as it was when our lady peace began. When OLP wrote gravity raine was just entering his thirties. That's not terribly old but think about all the music they had performed before then? I mean they had four albums under there belt already and a lot of tours. And now its 9 years later and raines almost 40. You can't just disregard mileage like that, especially when raine was, for the most part, using a singing style (falsetto) that puts extra strain on the vocal chords.
He is more comfortable with some of the songs off earlier albums (and he can still sing some of them really well live like naveed, which i think is why they almost always play it) But overall he just can't reach those high notes like he used to consistently. You can literally hear his voice struggling when he sings on a lot of songs, not even just older ones. There are whole songs on youtube where you can tell he just can't get there. And I agree that if he tried to do more of those older songs live he would probably burn out his voice even faster. Did anyone see that interview he did where he was talking about something he used to do.. I don't remember what it was an exercise or something like that? But he was worried that it would ruin his voice so he stopped doing it..
You can come at it from that angle, sure, but we also have to consider how Bob Rock engineered his voice to sing at a lower octave. Remember, there was an immediate change from SM to Gravity. Notice how in certain moments, like in Wipe That Smile, he goes off into his falsetto tangent, and he also does that live sometimes. The reason he "can't reach" the high notes in live renditions of songs like One Man Army is because he's singing in a lower octave realm, as taught by Bob Rock. It's hard for him to get out of that.
If I try to sing OMA in that lower realm I can't reach the higher notes either, but if I switch my voice to my falsetto realm, I can reach them. I just think Raine doesn't "know" how to switch back. or just doesn't bother to try. But then again, he is getting older and HAS toured A LOT. It could be a combination of these two reasons or just one of them. We may never know, really, unless some interviewer finally gets the ballsack to address this issue (though interviewers usually don't give two shits about the bands they interview and just do a quick Wikipedia search before asking questions).
gambit07 wrote:I totally agree with you, it will probably always be up in the air whether or not raine actually can still sing those high octaves, but personally for the most part I don't believe that he can. If you think about it it's probably affected there creativity as well, since he can't play with the song structure vocally as much as he used to. If you listen to a lot of the live recordings there are songs that he for sure just cannot hit anymore. I mean I don't know how anyone can argue that, there are just songs he flat out cannot reach the notes. And I think that's why he doesn't sing the high stuff in studio anymore.. In that environment sure, I'm betting he can hit higher notes and use his falsetto more as well as get some tuning help to get it right, but I'm certain it wouldn't be easy for him anymore. And then he would be expected to take those songs out live and I have a feeling he just would not be able to do it. Even in the live recording of dreamland off the burn burn dvd you can tell he's off key a lot of the time, and those aren't even high notes. Basically what I'm trying to say is raines voice is absolutely not the same as it was when our lady peace began. When OLP wrote gravity raine was just entering his thirties. That's not terribly old but think about all the music they had performed before then? I mean they had four albums under there belt already and a lot of tours. And now its 9 years later and raines almost 40. You can't just disregard mileage like that, especially when raine was, for the most part, using a singing style (falsetto) that puts extra strain on the vocal chords.
He is more comfortable with some of the songs off earlier albums (and he can still sing some of them really well live like naveed, which i think is why they almost always play it) But overall he just can't reach those high notes like he used to consistently. You can literally hear his voice struggling when he sings on a lot of songs, not even just older ones. There are whole songs on youtube where you can tell he just can't get there. And I agree that if he tried to do more of those older songs live he would probably burn out his voice even faster. Did anyone see that interview he did where he was talking about something he used to do.. I don't remember what it was an exercise or something like that? But he was worried that it would ruin his voice so he stopped doing it..
You don't lose your tuning by getting old/using your voice a lot (if anything, the more you sing the better your pitch should be). I can have barely any voice at all if I'm sick, doesn't mean I'm gonna go flat. It's a matter of technique, not vocal production.
I'm not sure on the falsetto issue, because I haven't been combing the live performances like you have, but his voice in his natural register sounds fine. It's still seems healthy and strong. It just seems like he's not using it right. Singing heavy a lot of the time, sliding around, going flat, bad vowel shapes, falling off the notes instead of keeping the air moving, that kinda stuff. It's lazy singing, really.
I don't wanna sound like I'm coming down on Raine a lot, it's just, as I said before, I'm really anal about this kind of thing. It hurts me to hear one of my favourite singers dropping the ball (and in a couple of places it just plain hurts me to hear him. bleh). Didn't he used to take lessons from a super-expensive chick in Toronto? I wonder what happened to her...
-Annie (Whee! boring signature!)
Member of the Pokémon League
I really can not believe that anyone has a problem with the lyrics on Burn Burn, I think there amazing, love absolutely love the lyrics in paper moon, refuge, escape artist, monkey brains,and believe it or not dreamland
Flynn wrote:I really can not believe that anyone has a problem with the lyrics on Burn Burn, I think there amazing, love absolutely love the lyrics in paper moon, refuge, escape artist, monkey brains,and believe it or not dreamland
Well, Burn Burn has overtaken all OLP songs on America's iTunes. Here's the order of most downloads for Burn Burn:
All You Did Was Save My Life
Paper Moon
Dreamland
Never Get Over You
The End is Where We Begin
The Right Stuff
Refuge
Escape Artist
Signs of Life
White Flags
Monkey Brains
Time Bomb
So... Here's my little review for Burn Burn, for anyone who cares.
When the word about Our Lady Peace's latest studio effort, "Burn Burn," made it's way to the general public, things started off a bit shakey. With promises of a return to their roots and a proper rock record, fans heard the album's first single, "All You Did Was Save My Life." The panic among the die-hards was almost unanimous. For what many fans find as arguably their worst song, to have it as the first peak at the record was a bit heart-breaking to say the least. Some kept their hope, while others were losing it quickly. The opinions started to turn around though once the sample of "Monkey Brains" made it's way to ourladypeace.net, along with the full song release of "Paper Moon." Whether or not the optimistic and pessimistic outlooks were justified lies all in the opinion of those who hold it though.
The record turns out to be a bit bittersweet. We finally see the band making attempts at bringing back the creativity to their music, which is what fans have been waiting for since 2002, when "Gravity" brought the fall of their poppy-yet-strange music. Some songs succeed at this, while others fail. The bitter side to this record is the band has shed the skin of an alternative rock band, and has joined the ranks of power ballad bands such as Lifehouse. Don't get me wrong though, they are better than the average power ballad band as they can still kick out rock songs such as "Monkey Brains," but it seems as if the band has lost a bit of the passion and energy to do more of this.
There's nothing wrong with having a softer song (or even a ballad) here and there, but Burn Burn overdoes it. The album has two songs that wouldn't be considered ballads or power ballads throughout the majority of the song, those being "Monkey Brains" and "White Flags." When seeing the cover and hearing the title, one would be inclined to think that the band finally has that fire lit once again for a dark, heavy fist-clenching record. Sadly, you'd be mistaken. Instead your ears are met with somber vocals and lyrics of love lost. Once again, there's nothing wrong with it here and there, but Burn Burn doesn't seem to want to step out of it's own formula.
Predictability is yet another problem. After a few songs you can pretty much say, "Well this next one will be verse, chorus, verse, chorus, bridge, probably a solo, and some more of the chorus. Oh yeah, and it'll start kind soft and build, but not build up to too much." There are a few exceptions to this formula, such as "White Flags" and "Monkey Brains" being heavier throughout (along with Monkey Brains' unexpected bridge; not it's position, just it's sound) and Paper Moon's lack of a bridge and unneeded extra choruses.
For the first time in the band's existance, I find that the bridges are weak. This causes a lot of songs to feel as if they've overstayed their welcome after the second chorus. Fine examples of this are "Dreamland," "Never Get Over You," and "The End Is Where We Begin."
Sadly, Jeremy Taggart is absent yet again for a good portion of this record. In a lot of these songs, you can just imagine him doing something a bit or more complex, if not unconventional. Instead he sticks with the most basic and uninspired drums beats for just about every song. He may play around with the hi-hats a bit, but his work on the toms and snare seem to be just about the same for every song during the verses. I only wish he would experiment a bit more. However, we do get to see him shine on the band favorite, "Refuge," and he does have a few good moments in the chorus of "Dreamland." I also like his simple yet effective drumming that opens up "Escape Artist," even if I wish he would have build on later in the song to make some more "odd" drum fills.
I'm proud to say Duncan Coutts is back as a force on this record. He makes noticable appearances on this record having nice grooves, and even when he's doing something more straight-forward and simple, he's at least noticable. It's a nice change from the past two records where we would make a random appearance here and there (probably the most notable would be "Bring Back the Sun" and "Boy"). Great songs by Mr. Coutts would be his driving bassline in "Monkey Brains" and especially towards the end of "Escape Artist."
Steve Mazur gets to finally shine for the first time in the studio. I believe he can shine brighter, but Burn Burn wasn't a bad place to start. Fans have noted his abilities during live shows, where he can give a song a completely different vibe or come up with a great improv. Unfortunately, an album full of ballads is not a place for Mazur to shine as bright as he can. He has what it takes to put more energy and excitement into a record, with "Monkey Brains," the "Paper Moon" solo, and the second half of "Escape Artist" to prove it. Steve tries to instill that into some of the ballads on this record with a quick line of distortion, but it comes off as a bit annoying after awhile, as I don't think it can really fool anyone into thinking that it's a "rocking" song. I'll applaud him for trying to liven it up, but I hope on the next album he can spread his wings even more instead of forcing himself to lift a song up. One area he might need to improve in is finding a proper way for him and Maida to click. On past records, Mike Turner's quirky guitar work complemented Raine's nasally falsetto in an excellent way. I'd like to see Mazur find a way to complement however Raine sings on the next record.
Frontman Raine Maida is kind of disappointing on this record. While the lyrics aren't a huge let down, his delivery of them and his vocals are. Maida has never before sounded this lifeless and uninspired. There are moments where it seems he attempts (with little effort) to bring himself out of it, but it just comes off as louder yet still uninspired. Maida also only utilizes his amazing ability of falsetto in one song on the record, that being in the chorus of "Paper Moon" (although he hints at it s few times in the verses of "Escape Artist"). I'm not asking for him to use it as frequently as he did on "Happiness... Is Not a Fish That You Can Catch" or "Spiritual Machines," but having it peppered in here and there would also improve the song. One thing I can say though is that I'll continue to find it a bit disappointing until he finally sings with emotion again. The album "Naveed" is a perfect example of this, as he still sang with all that he had in unique melodies, despite not relying on his falsetto. Back on the subject of lyrics though. Nothing is all that bad, but it is kind of irking when Maida can turn an unrelated subject into sounding like it's about love or a lover. "Escape Artist" is a fine example, as he said it's about getting back to basics and relieving yourself of all the extra bullshit around you, yet he uses his words in a way that makes it sound like it's about his wife. Maybe that's his attempt at being cryptic, but I'm not too sure. If Maida still wants to be somewhat straight-foward, I think it'd improve the quality of the songs if he wrote in his quirky, catchy way of writing like he does in "The Hunter's Lullaby." Lyrically he shines on "Monkey Brains," "Escape Artist," "Refuge," and "White Flags." Vocally he stands out on "Dreamland" (more specifically in the build-up to the chorus), "Monkey Brains," "Refuge," and the chorus of "Paper Moon."
Song Rundown
All You Did Was Save My Life There isn't much to say about this track. Nothing really stands out too much, besides that it appears that Raine was attempting to write more metaphorically. What somewhat saves the song is Steve and Duncan yelling out the backing vocals in the background. Overall, the song is very overproduced and a blatant attempt at having a hit, despite having little to enjoy for quite a few people who really like to sink their teeth into the music.
Dreamland If Our Lady Peace wanted to have a catchy, poppy lead single, it should have been more in the vein of this song. Steve does nice with soft guitar work on this song, and I think Raine really shines vocally on this, as you can actually here some emotion in the build-up to the chorus and the chorus as well. The song starts to overstay it's welcome once it hits a weak bridge, but it's nice to hear Steve's guitar work at the end as Raine repeats "I'm not coming down."
Monkey Brains* This is more of what I was hoping for with Burn Burn. Duncan's bassline drives the song and only gets wilder in the chorus. Steve's talent is finally unleashed in the studio. Raine sounds great in the chorus and a bit paranoid in the verses, along with the lyrics being actually pretty good. Jeremy is still playing pretty basic, but his work on the hi-hats help the atmosphere of the song. The track eventually leads to the soft acoustic bridge, which is an overall good piece of music. I understand that the band was trying to do something unexpected here, but it doesn't even sound like it belongs, as it kind of sounds like two completely different songs just placed together. They could have gone about it in a better way, but both the song and the bridge are sure to impress old and new fans alike.
The End Is Where We Begin The song starts nice with a bassline and Steve channeling U2's The Edge. The chorus is also kind of unexpected to start in the way it does, but the song kind of drops off after this. The lyrics in the second verse are okay and Jer is rocking his cymbals, but I find myself wanting the song to just end once it gets to a weak bridge and a predictable solo.
Escape Artist* The song starts with Jeremy doing a simple-yet-effective drum beat, and is soon followed with Duncan with an awesome driving bassline, acoustic guitar, and an elevating piano. Maida stands out with lyrics, and his voice becomes better once it comes time for the chorus. The backing vocals also make an impact as they yell out to the listener "You're the ghost!" Steve also becomes a force in the chorus and just about the entire second half of the song. "Escape Artist" ends on a passionate note, as it reverts back to something similar to the beginning of the song.
Refuge* This song is a excellent effort by all members of the band. Jeremy hasn't shined like he does on this track for awhile, finally utilizing the snare, bass drum, and toms. Duncan may not exactly be going wild on this track, but he definitely keeps the song going. Steve does awesome work in "Refuge," as he makes the guitar sound more like an organ, and goes onto a more uplifting sound in the chorus. Raine sings with so much more passion on this song than he does on any other track on this record, and his lyrics paint beautiful imagery. I wasn't sure about it when I first heard the sample on .net, but now I can definitely see why this is a band favorite.
Never Get Over You This is another of a song that falls off after the second chorus, but not as bad as "Dreamland" does, and it actually becomes more likeable after a few listens. The lyrics in the first verse are pretty powerful (besides the cheesy "She likes hockey"), but the second verse falls prey to cliches. What really stands out is Steve's simple work on the dulcimer, giving the song a different feel. The band also gives the chorus a very anthemic feel.
White Flags Coming off the live version, this song is a huge disappointment. The lyrics are actually really enjoyable for the most part, but the vocals and guitar work seem to fail. Raine's singing, the backing vocals, and the guitar work and production all seem to be trying too hard. This song is supposed to be simpler, but they tried too hard to make this song a bit too perfect, which really takes it down a few notches. The solo is good, but Raine's whole "fall with you" deal takes away some of the enjoyment.
Signs of Life "Signs of Life" isn't as bad as most people make it out to be. It's actually kind of refreshing to see the band do an acoustic song. The lyrics are pretty enjoyable, and the backing vocals in the chorus really get me hooked. I feel like the solo could have had more life, but it's nice to see a minimal song like this every once in awhile.
Paper Moon* This song is another stand-out. While it doesn't have the same replay-ability as OLP's earlier work, it's sure to be in your head for awhile after the first few listens. Steve does quite a few interesting things on this record, such as his very blues-y sound throughout a large portion, along with his minute long solo. There's no doubt that he pretty much owns this song. The sleighbells also make a good edition to the atmosphere. As for Raine, it's nice to finally hear some falsetto on this record. The lyrics are also pretty good, especially in the first verse and definitely in the chorus.
Despite what some OLP fans might say, this is not their best record... Not even close in my opinion. Whether it's the novelty of it or not that makes some feel this, I still feel it hasn't topped any of the earlier work. It's more ambitious than Gravity, and has a freedom that Healthy didn't, but I don't feel I can say where it stands among those three yet. While it's a good album for what it is, I hope they can branch outside of ballads the next time around and regain more of their own sound, instead of the U2 immitation/slight OLP sound Burn Burn gave us. While it may sound like I was mainly negative with my review of it, there is still some to love in it, which I have also pointed out. The boys may not be on their A-Game this time, but if you're a die-hard it should give you something to enjoy. Unfortunately, a lot of the record is rather forgetable, so that's going to my rating down a bit as well.
For my rating, I've decided on a 2.5/5. Whether I'm being generous since I'm a hardcore fan or not, I'm not really sure.
I did not read all of this but many of you forget how Raine was influenced by Bono at a young age. Bono has a good 10 years on Raine... Just as a teenager may be inspired, influenced by OLP.. They were ispired by U2 among others. I remeber hearing how Duncan and Raine were in a u2 cover band when younger( before OLP)
There has always been a somewhat U2 feel to a song off almost every cd from them. That is not bad. I heard U2 all over Naveed when I first bought that cd.
As for Raine being a humanitarian like Bono is. Bono did not corner the market on that. Look at George Harrison and Bangladesh. Sir Bob Geldoff with Live Aid. Willie Nelson, John Mellencamp and others with Farm Aid. THe list goes on..
P.S MOL I could not read all your review. I printed and read it later.
Why would you think we would not care. Just cause I might not agree does not mean I would not read what others say. Just as I would appreciate others not jumping down my throat if I like the cd. Which I do. I also love the new U2 cd. The guitar is amazing and it is great to hear Edge play like that again.
BTW I am huge U2 fan. Have been for almost 30 years now..
I feel love, I feel a power. It comes to me in the darkest hour. And I want to feel it again Teach the young people how to think, not what to think-Sidney Sugarman
Question: Why is this written as a news article? Are you posting this somewhere as a cd review somewhere else? Just curious...
-Sarah Goodbye you liar, Well you sipped from the cup but you don't own up to anything Then you think you will inspire Take apart your head (and I wish I could inspire) Take apart your demons, then you add it to the list.
