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Posted: 7/15/2004, 10:57 am
by Rusty
Sufjan Stevens wrote:That would be grand and all, but I don't see the US doing anything like that. The leaders of this country are overzealous and will keep getting into people's business we have no business being in. We don't need anyone else to help us out. We keep a couple of alliances, like Canada, Great Britian, and maybe a couple more from the EU, and we will be fine. We can keep helping fight the AIDS epidemic in all those African nations, and that should be it. We don't need to do anything else. Hell, we don't need to help the African nations out, but we still should, because they're too fucking stupid to properly operate a condom.


it's not that their stupid and don't know how to use a condom as said before a lot of the children are being born with it and remember that Africa is a very poor country so many families are poor and many of the children there are forced to prostitute themselves just so they can get enough money for dinner that day and stay alive. Of course the u.s.a. doesn't have to help the third world countries or anything else, but it's called human courtesy, there are children, parents, people in general dying over there and other places, and america and other countries like canada, and britain and such have money to donate to try and help them, nobody should have to live in those conditions what if america was like africa and africa was like america but africa didn't want to help because they didn't have too, they just said well america is too stupid to know how to use a condom let them die.

Posted: 7/15/2004, 11:36 am
by lemonphile4
As far as condoms go, the reason why they aren't used as often as they should is because people in that area of the world simply don't have access to condoms or aren't aware of how the disease is spread- although there are many, many education programs around now. Still, you can't reach everyone.

Posted: 7/15/2004, 11:48 am
by Henrietta
Posted: 7/15/2004, 10:07 am Post subject:

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I wish we were isolated again. I legitimately do. This country could be self-sufficient without having to import things from countries that really have nothing to offer us. Not to mention half the countries we give out loans to will never be albe to pay us back (read: every African nation) and if we try to collect on our money, we're called "Great Satan" and everyone thrashes us.


That's exactly what I think. We spend too much time trying to be everyone's savior. We need to make sure we are stable here, this outsouring business has got to stop. Contrary to popular opinion, just because we have alot of money doesn't make us obligated to keep pouring money into other countries and the problem is just getting worse. Don't get me wrong, human compassion is exactly what this world needs. But it's not our duty as a COUNTRY, it's our duty as individuals to be compassionate. It should be the individuals decision to donate money and time to educating these countries, for example.

Posted: 7/15/2004, 7:01 pm
by Corey
How do you suppose you prevent the outsourcing of jobs? The only way to do that is to incorporate a tariff on the export of services or reduce minimum wage.

Posted: 7/15/2004, 7:21 pm
by Henrietta
Not everything should not be allowed to be outsourced. But yes, tariffs could work.

Posted: 7/15/2004, 9:55 pm
by nelison
tariffs.

Posted: 7/15/2004, 11:45 pm
by Bandalero
Joe Cool wrote:The United States has used its fair share of WMD's.


Pakistan and India have tested nuclear weapons to try and intimidate the other side. that's far less responsible then the use of Nuclear Weapons by the US.

How do you suppose you prevent the outsourcing of jobs? The only way to do that is to incorporate a tariff on the export of services or reduce minimum wage.


here's one way. ok, you can outsource jobs to other countries, but were not sticking our necks to those countries to help secure your investment in another country.

for example. if XYZ company sends jobs to Reno Rico, and a revolution ensues in that country to where i am in power and i decide to annex those assets from XYZ, the US will not give a damn. it's XYZ's loss not the US, because the US would prefer that those jobs be in the states and not in Reno Rico. any hostages captured will not be subject to negotiation, and no we will not send a team in to go get them or any assets.

besides, it's Reno Rico for god's sake, I'm a good guy. :D trust that smile.

Posted: 7/16/2004, 6:15 am
by Corey
Could also provide tax break incentives for keeping jobs in the states.

Posted: 7/24/2004, 3:33 am
by modern psychokitty
Yeah... those tariffs... gotta love them. Especially the illegal ones that have pretty much destroyed my province's economy. :D

(Message to the American officials who signed NAFTA: Don't fucking make agreements you don't want to keep, assholes.)



Please don't put those people in Africa down. Most of those countries have only been around for thirty years, at the very most, and were ruled by the imperial powers of Europe before then, under laws that prevented them from being educated, and basically ensured that there wasn't anyone properly qualified to lead the country when they were suddenly tossed out on their own. Sure, they wanted freedom, but so does any teenager. They just weren't armed with the knowledge they needed to make it right off the bat. For instance, most of the new countries embarked on ambitious projects like highways linking everything together... projects that drained their economies, and were eventually left uncompleted.

Since then, they've had famines, droughts, and outbreaks of probably every disease that exists in the world today, which naturally has led to massive political unrest, which in turn led to an even worse situation where children were fighting wars in Sierra Leone, and people were being slaughtered at a rate faster than the Holocaust in Rwanda, while the world looked on. (One of my favourite things about Rwanda is that there was an American presence there at the time, but they wouldn't block off the Hate Radio station giving people instructions to butcher their neighbours because it would violate the First Amendment.)

Oh, but there's more. Most of Africa's most valuable resources, such as oil, and diamonds, are being exploited by major corporations from industrialised countries that simply aren't putting anything back into the economies of the nations they are in. One of the biggest culprits is Cameco, based in my home province, providing a full college scholarship as well as an internship to one of my closest friends, and sucking oil out of the nation of Congo without giving them adequate reparations for it. It's to the point where people steal oil from the pipelines for their own use or to sell it to make a little bit of money, and then there's a nasty accident.

And then there's malaria. A disease that's never affected the rich, industrialised nations of the world, and has therefore been almost completely ignored, even though it is a far greater detriment to the developing world than even AIDS. Yes, malaria can be treated with quinine, but the disease has begun to show resistance to even that. Meanwhile, polio, which *did* affect the western world, has been almost completely eradicated.

And the spread of AIDS has little do with being able to properly operate a condom. There's TONS of other factors, number one being that people there are POOR. We're talking about nations where everyone is starving to death, and you expect them to have adequate access to condoms, even if the world is doing their best to provide them?

Secondly, the rampant spread of STD's in our own society should remind us that condoms don't always work. In nations where the spread of AIDS seems to be continuing unimpeded despite their presence, there's likely oodles of myths about them, and about sex in general, including that the west is trying to eliminate all African people by halting the birth rate.

For example, here's a real gem: having sex with a virgin will cure AIDS. I promise you. There are NEWBORN BABIES that are getting RAPED over there because people think that!!! And even when they aren't raped at birth, the average age an African kid loses their virginity is 10. Yes, 10. They are probably thousands of people who've lost baby teeth in the process.

Lastly, we find that depressed teenagers in our society often tend to become, well, slutty. We especially see it with girls; I've even experienced it to some extent myself. Since our lives aren't even a *fraction* as shitty as theirs are, imagine the effect there. And the "it won't happen to me" attitude isn't limited to North America. That's one of main concepts of the education programs: "It CAN and WILL happen to you."

So what needs to be done?

First of all, that superiority complex has got to go. We've just been fortunate enough to be born after that stage in our own society, and it has nothing to do with their intelligence. Remember, our ancestors thought dumping grain and a blanket in a bucket would spontaneously generate a mouse.

Secondly, we must keep track of every single disease in Africa. Contrary to popular belief, we are NOT just helping with the AIDS crisis out of pure benevolence. Any mutation that occurs there could return to bite us in the ass, and then we'd all be screwed. If HIV somehow combined with ebola into some super-disease and we weren't watching... OH. MY. GOD. (Yeah, I realise that particular scenario isn't very likely to happen, or even quite possible, but I'm making a point.)

But the most important thing, in my opinion, is that we have to reduce farm subsidies in our own nations. While the subsidies, which Bush is a big fan of, and one of my biggest problems with him, do allow farmers to continue to produce in times when they wouldn't be able to otherwise, but only because they allow farmers to sell at a lower price without actually losing money. Unfortunately, that drives down the world price to the point where poorer countries can't afford to grow many crops. For instance, cotton sells at 40% of its production cost, meaning the govt must subsidise 60% of it. Most countries can't afford that, and we have to even the playing field.

If Africa as a whole could increase their market share in agriculture by a mere 1%, it would amount to around 70 billion dollars annually. That's something like five times what they get in aid right now. And that's better for ALL of us.



And Corey: I can almost guarantee that the govt will go the tax break route. People love tax breaks. (I still think my idea, which is to raise the standard of living in the rest of the world, which in turn makes it more expensive for corporations to outsource, is the smarter choice. But govts only think in the short-term, because long-term solutions don't help them get re-elected.)

Posted: 7/24/2004, 1:14 pm
by Corey
modern psychokitty wrote:And Corey: I can almost guarantee that the govt will go the tax break route. People love tax breaks. (I still think my idea, which is to raise the standard of living in the rest of the world, which in turn makes it more expensive for corporations to outsource, is the smarter choice. But govts only think in the short-term, because long-term solutions don't help them get re-elected.)


Interesting.... outsourcing jobs is exactly HOW you can raise the standard of living in another area. See, more jobs means more money. More money means more spending. More spending means more jobs... See where this is going?

Posted: 7/28/2004, 3:10 am
by modern psychokitty
Not all parts of the world have the same types of industry, though.

I guess what I really mean to say is there are ways of doing things so everyone benefits. Some people probably wouldn't be *quite* as well off as they would be if everyone else was in the shitter. But that's not nearly as controversial or exciting, and then people aren't interested.

Posted: 7/29/2004, 4:37 pm
by starseed_10
Corey wrote:
modern psychokitty wrote:And Corey: I can almost guarantee that the govt will go the tax break route. People love tax breaks. (I still think my idea, which is to raise the standard of living in the rest of the world, which in turn makes it more expensive for corporations to outsource, is the smarter choice. But govts only think in the short-term, because long-term solutions don't help them get re-elected.)


Interesting.... outsourcing jobs is exactly HOW you can raise the standard of living in another area. See, more jobs means more money. More money means more spending. More spending means more jobs... See where this is going?



Are you up for another Football league this year?? :spam:

Posted: 7/29/2004, 9:09 pm
by Corey
damn straight

Posted: 7/29/2004, 9:10 pm
by starseed_10
nice.

Posted: 7/30/2004, 11:41 am
by Henrietta
If he goverment doesn't do the farm subsidies, there won't be any food left produced in our country. What the hell is gonna happen when something happens and God forbid we actually have to feed ourselves? Well, there won't be anyone who's got a clue how to do it, not to mention any land that has been prepared for it.

Posted: 7/30/2004, 11:53 am
by Bandalero
genetical engineering cass.

we will engineer ourselves to become people who don't need to eat?

:lol: :lol:

sorry, i like giving cass a hard time. :mrgreen:

Posted: 7/30/2004, 12:07 pm
by Henrietta
Hey, let's test on Reno.

Posted: 7/30/2004, 12:15 pm
by Bandalero
no way cass, i know that what you want is a world filled with reno's but its not happening.

Posted: 7/30/2004, 12:24 pm
by Henrietta
You didn't say cloning.

Posted: 7/30/2004, 12:28 pm
by Bandalero
that's what i'm implying.