"Partial birth" abortions

Sufjan Stevens · Post by **Sufjan Stevens** » 6/6/2003, 9:54 pm

I was just trying to make a funny.

One-Eye · Post by **One-Eye** » 6/6/2003, 9:55 pm

In that case: :lol:

Galaxia · Post by **Galaxia** » 6/6/2003, 11:17 pm

Aerin wrote:True. But there's also such a thing as too much hovering. I know a lot of people whose parents were so crazily overprotective that the kids went NUTS with alcohol, sex, drugs, etc. as soon as they got to college.

It's a fine line parents have to walk between too much parenting and not enough.

I totally agree. I've seen that happen loads of times. Sometimes there is just no stopping the wild child. Sneaking out happens a lot. I do sneak out all the time with all the boyfriends my parents don't know about. But hey, I'm a virgin. Sneaking out with boys doesn't always = sex. A little good parenting will teach a kid right from wrong. Good parenting doesn't exactly include the banning of sex either. It could mean just drilling into your child's mind the importance of protected sex. If your child gets pregnant, you have failed in one way or another.

First-trimester abortions aren't killing a baby. They are terminating a pregnancy. There was never any "baby" involved. It sickens me when people try to make women feel guilty about "killing" something that meets almost none of the requirements to qualify as ALIVE, let alone HUMAN.

The name of this thread is '"Partial Birth" Abortions'. It is a whole different thing from a first trimester abortion. In my opinion, if it has a heartbeat, it shouldn't be terminated. If you don't want a child, use birth control. Rape is a whole different ball game. But if you are gonna get it scraped, do it while it is still a bunch of multiplying cells. Don't put it off till it has a heartbeat.

One-Eye · Post by **One-Eye** » 6/6/2003, 11:41 pm

Galaxia wrote:The name of this thread is '"Partial Birth" Abortions'. It is a whole different thing from a first trimester abortion. In my opinion, if it has a heartbeat, it shouldn't be terminated. If you don't want a child, use birth control. Rape is a whole different ball game. But if you are gonna get it scraped, do it while it is still a bunch of multiplying cells. Don't put it off till it has a heartbeat.

That's a valid opinion. I personally find it very difficult to draw a line between when it's okay to terminate a pregnancy and when it becomes infanticide. If we were to legislate against abortion, I would support something along the lines of:

1st trimester: abortions okay
2nd trimester: only under certain medical circumstances
3rd trimester: abortions illegal

But then, I also know that this is my opinion and that others do not share it. So objectively, I think the government should keep abortions legal (except perhaps in the case of partial-birth, which is murder), and let people make their own informed decisions based on their circumstances and their personal moral code.

Galaxia · Post by **Galaxia** » 6/6/2003, 11:50 pm

Corey · Post by **Corey** » 6/7/2003, 6:42 am

Aerin wrote:But then, I also know that this is my opinion and that others do not share it. So objectively, I think the government should keep abortions legal (except perhaps in the case of partial-birth, which is murder), and let people make their own informed decisions based on their circumstances and their personal moral code.

I believe that is what the government is doing, only making partial-birth abortions illegal.

Axtech · Post by **Axtech** » 6/7/2003, 3:50 pm

I'd just like to put in that I think we should stop saying stuff like "when people say < insert comment from another person on the board >, it makes me sick". You can say that ideas make you sick, but the opinions of others on the board should be left out of such comments, if for nothing other than politeness and tact.

Besides, I think, going with the title of the thread, that we are all in agreement. Because we've kind of come to terms with that, I think it's safe to venture into the touchy world of other abortions, keeping in mind that everyone's opinion is valid and that we're all just throwing out ideas.

understandablehorror · Post by **understandablehorror** » 6/7/2003, 8:17 pm

we are all in agreement but this thread has become more or less a moral parenting thread, where do parents draw the line in overparenting. i think it should be a mutual decision between child and parent, that creates trust, my parents are very lenient with me but i still respect their trust, if the kid isnt respecting their parents'
trust they dont deserve to go out with friends, but thats just my opinion

happening fish · Post by **happening fish** » 6/8/2003, 11:15 am

There are these billboards in my city that have a picture of some smiling teenage girls and say something like,

"PREGNANT?
It's your choice. You don't have to have an abortion."

Now... is it just me or is that the stupidest thing ever? First it tells girls its their choice, and then it implies that the only right choice is to not have an abortion. So really it is not advocating a choice at all... it's just pretending it is.

One-Eye · Post by **One-Eye** » 6/8/2003, 2:42 pm

LAME.

understandablehorror · Post by **understandablehorror** » 6/8/2003, 4:11 pm

definitely lame

Corey · Post by **Corey** » 6/9/2003, 6:19 am

happeninfish wrote:There are these billboards in my city that have a picture of some smiling teenage girls and say something like,

"PREGNANT?
It's your choice. You don't have to have an abortion."

Now... is it just me or is that the stupidest thing ever? First it tells girls its their choice, and then it implies that the only right choice is to not have an abortion. So really it is not advocating a choice at all... it's just pretending it is.

Would you believe that if it said:

"PREGNANT? It's your choice. You don't have to have the baby."

that it would be advocating a choice?

One-Eye · Post by **One-Eye** » 6/9/2003, 2:22 pm

That would be just as bad. It should say:

"PREGNANT? It's your choice. Have the baby or don't. We don't really care."

happening fish · Post by **happening fish** » 6/9/2003, 2:25 pm

You missed my point, Corey. I know you like trying to trap me into things (

) but Aerin is absolutely right, that would be just as bad. I just hate the fact that they think they can (and do) get away with manipulating young girls in a painful and overwhelming situation. It is, in fact, taking advantage of them, whichever way the pendulum swings.

Axtech · Post by **Axtech** » 6/9/2003, 2:40 pm

Aerin wrote:That would be just as bad. It should say:

"PREGNANT? It's your choice. Have the baby or don't. We don't really care."

If only all advertisements were like that...

"THIRSTY? Drink Coke! ... or not. Whatever... It's up to you."

happening fish · Post by **happening fish** » 6/9/2003, 2:41 pm

Corey · Post by **Corey** » 6/9/2003, 2:59 pm

happeninfish wrote:You missed my point, Corey. I know you like trying to trap me into things ( ) but Aerin is absolutely right, that would be just as bad. I just hate the fact that they think they can (and do) get away with manipulating young girls in a painful and overwhelming situation. It is, in fact, taking advantage of them, whichever way the pendulum swings.

No, I totally saw your point. I was just curious that if the opposite made you feel the same way. I believe it is common to hear from many pro-choice people that "It's the woman's choice! She can have an abortion if she wants to!" It is interesting to hear those words turned around because it then sounds like it isn't really a choice after all. I believe that is the true point of the poster. These pro-choice organizations are almost convincing women to have abortions merely because it is their "choice". Indeed it is their choice, but by pounding that philosophy, young women may feel like they have no other option and that it is almost expected of them without considering all of the factors. Maybe I'm looking too deep into the poster, but to me, it really has a double meaning, almost as if it is fighting the pro-choice propaganda with their own tactics.

Axtech · Post by **Axtech** » 6/9/2003, 3:02 pm

I think pro-choicers mainly come out when abortions are made illegal, or if abortion clinics are being shut down. Pro-choicers aren't after people to have abortions, they just want the option opened to everyone.

Corey · Post by **Corey** » 6/9/2003, 3:05 pm

Right but what is the usual message of pro-choice?

"It's your choice. You can have an abortion if you want to."

Axtech · Post by **Axtech** » 6/9/2003, 3:06 pm

Correct.

Because the other side is "Don't have an abortion", so saying "It's your choice" would leave things unbalanced. Implying that abortion is one of the options lets uninformed people know what's out there for them to do.

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"Partial birth" abortions