If it is naturally occuring, and even naturally accepted in most cultures, when abrahamic thought is not involved, then this can only be seen as a naturally occuring event. And if God makes men and women, he also makes gay men and women. It is doubtful that God curses his creations from birth, unless you believe in Karma, which Westener's do not. Therefore if homosexuality is part of gods creation, or natures plan, then it must be accepted as acceptable. Because an ancient interpretation, that has been changed, and possibly tampered with/mis translated, that was not even written by God himself but by one of his human followers, who also suffered from human bias, says that something is wrong that does not nessasaily mean it is in God's eyes. Look at the actual physical evidence of God in our lives and it tells a much diffrent story.
This is why a growing number of monastics, and priests have changed their view on homosexuality.
Gay, Lesbian, Bi-Sexual, Two-Spirited, Transexual
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
Joe Cooler wrote:Mmhmm. I don't recall ever specifically arguing againts that point in the first place.
keep in mind i'm also arguing points with several other people
as i pointed out earlier Sinead made several false comments earlier
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
i suppose so, but if she thinks that homosexual behaviour has always been taboo in all cultures she is wrong.
i find this conversation very intresting i love my soc. and world religions classes, this is a good way to practice for tests
Ironic how i'm probably switching my major to Religion eh?
actually i have world religion tommorow morning, i should bring upsome of these points and debate them in class. We have a small class so we have lots of discussion. We've been discussing homosexuality in religion, primarily the Lakota.
i find this conversation very intresting i love my soc. and world religions classes, this is a good way to practice for tests
Ironic how i'm probably switching my major to Religion eh?
actually i have world religion tommorow morning, i should bring upsome of these points and debate them in class. We have a small class so we have lots of discussion. We've been discussing homosexuality in religion, primarily the Lakota.
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
No, see cass explained it to me. At least in her faith, they believe other non-abrahamic religions/cultures are people that originally knew about God and then steered off the straight and narrow.
If you believe in the whole adam and eve thing, it's the only way that makes sense. God created all people, apparently.
However, that can't be really used to discredit your point about natives, because obviously native cultures existed, no matter which way you look at it.
If you believe in the whole adam and eve thing, it's the only way that makes sense. God created all people, apparently.
However, that can't be really used to discredit your point about natives, because obviously native cultures existed, no matter which way you look at it.
Does anyone have a comment about the post i made at the top of this forum? I read it over and it was poorly written. Plus i tried to make several points in one post, it was kinda a stream of conciousness writing style, so it doesn't work that well.
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
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nikki4982
- Oskar Lifetime Achievement Award: 2007
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Oy. That's all I can say.
<table><tr><td>~ Nikki Edwards
Queen of the Harpies <img src="../phpBB2/files/queen_of_harpies.gif" align="texttop"></td><td><font color="orange">President of the Pookie Brigade</font>
"If you put those on the internet, I'll kill you guys!" - Jer</td></tr></table>
<center><img src="../phpBB2/files/squiggle.gif">
<font color="#3C8C8B">Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try, no hell below us,
above us only sky, imagine all the people, <font color="#FFFFFF">living</font> for today...</font>
<font color="#50B4B3">Imagine there's no countries, it isn't hard to do, nothing to kill or die
for, no religion too, imagine all the people, living <font color="#FFFFFF">life</font> in peace...</font>
<font color="#89CDCC">Imagine no possesions, I wonder if you can, no need for greed or <font color="#FFFFFF">hunger</font>,
a brotherhood of man, imagine all the people, sharing all the <font color="#FFFFFF">world</font>...</font>
<font color="#B1DFDE">You may say I'm a <font color="#FFFFFF">dreamer</font>, but I'm not the only one, I hope
some day you'll join us, and the world will <font color="#FFFFFF">live</font> as one.</font></center></font>
Queen of the Harpies <img src="../phpBB2/files/queen_of_harpies.gif" align="texttop"></td><td><font color="orange">President of the Pookie Brigade</font>
"If you put those on the internet, I'll kill you guys!" - Jer</td></tr></table>
<center><img src="../phpBB2/files/squiggle.gif">
<font color="#3C8C8B">Imagine there's no heaven, it's easy if you try, no hell below us,
above us only sky, imagine all the people, <font color="#FFFFFF">living</font> for today...</font>
<font color="#50B4B3">Imagine there's no countries, it isn't hard to do, nothing to kill or die
for, no religion too, imagine all the people, living <font color="#FFFFFF">life</font> in peace...</font>
<font color="#89CDCC">Imagine no possesions, I wonder if you can, no need for greed or <font color="#FFFFFF">hunger</font>,
a brotherhood of man, imagine all the people, sharing all the <font color="#FFFFFF">world</font>...</font>
<font color="#B1DFDE">You may say I'm a <font color="#FFFFFF">dreamer</font>, but I'm not the only one, I hope
some day you'll join us, and the world will <font color="#FFFFFF">live</font> as one.</font></center></font>
-
Henrietta
I'm not going to argue your point, because I've taken these classes too and I know how it is believed to be. I just have one thing to say abuot your earlier post. Yes, God made us. Yes, God loves us despite our mistakes and sins. That doesn't mean he loves our mistakes and sins. God made Hitler, God loves Hitler, I seriously doubt that he wants us to accept his murderous vendetta to millions of Jews. If you take a religious standpoint on the subject, or at least understand it, then you know that religious people are going to believe that homosexuality is not something God did to them, rather as something that went wrong somewhere on Earth.
But if they were proven to be created as such at the begining or early stages of their life? Is God really setting all these people up for failure? By the way, no one has ever actually shown me where in the Bible it says Homosexuality is a Sin, could someone actually give me a quote? I'm not trying to be a smartass i just actually have never seen the actual passage.
Anyways, I think it is fairly clear that Homosexuals do not choose this lifestyle, and with a number that large, or the population, possibly higher then already thought, it seems possible that this is some how a naturaly occuring thing. Or at least commmonly occuring. Yes, Homosexuals DO obviously choose to have sex, but Homosexuality is not just an action. It is a entire attraction and in some cases a lifestyle. Why would God bless a woman with the ability to Love, and then allow her to never feel mutual love with another person?
Anyways, last night while bored i tried to google some more information on the topic and stumbled onto The Jesus Christ Boards. Although there were 2 defenders on the board, the rest were obviously against Homosexuality. This in itself does not surprise me, and it's not the thing that irritated me. The way some of the "Christians" conducted themsleves and the use of "logic" was appaling. I gained a lot more respect for Cass and Taylor for at least being sensitive on the matter.
Anyways, I think it is fairly clear that Homosexuals do not choose this lifestyle, and with a number that large, or the population, possibly higher then already thought, it seems possible that this is some how a naturaly occuring thing. Or at least commmonly occuring. Yes, Homosexuals DO obviously choose to have sex, but Homosexuality is not just an action. It is a entire attraction and in some cases a lifestyle. Why would God bless a woman with the ability to Love, and then allow her to never feel mutual love with another person?
Anyways, last night while bored i tried to google some more information on the topic and stumbled onto The Jesus Christ Boards. Although there were 2 defenders on the board, the rest were obviously against Homosexuality. This in itself does not surprise me, and it's not the thing that irritated me. The way some of the "Christians" conducted themsleves and the use of "logic" was appaling. I gained a lot more respect for Cass and Taylor for at least being sensitive on the matter.
"How can we justify spending so much on destruction and so little on life?" Matthew Good
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
"The white dove is gone, the one world has come down hard, so why not share the pain of our problems, when all around are wrong ways, when all around is hurt, i'll roll up in an odd shape and wait, untill the tide has turned.....with anger, i'm dead weight, i'm anchored"- IME, God Rocket (Into the Heart of Las Vegas) ^ Some say this song is about a terrorists thoughts before 911
"Pray for the sheep" Matt Good
"But it's alright, take the world and make it yours again" Matt Good
I felt it in the wind, and i saw it in the sky, i thought it was the end, i thought it was the 4th of July.
"Hold on, hold on children, your mother and father are leaving, hold on, hold on children your best freind's parents are leaving, leaving,.......*AHHH*! " - Death From Above - Black History Month
-
Joe Cooler
I AM ME wrote:But if they were proven to be created as such at the begining or early stages of their life? Is God really setting all these people up for failure? By the way, no one has ever actually shown me where in the Bible it says Homosexuality is a Sin, could someone actually give me a quote? I'm not trying to be a smartass i just actually have never seen the actual passage.
"Do not lie with a man as one lies with a women. That is detestable" Leviticus 18:22 (NIV Translation)
"Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders, nor theives nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanders nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God." 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (NIV)
And for those of you who think that verse is contradictory to a message of salvation, know that the passage goes on to say..
"And this is what some of you were. But you were wacshed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God." 1 Corinthians 6:11
***Note: The King James Translation essentially says the same thing if you're only familiar with that version.
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Henrietta
-
faninor
- Oskar Lifetime Achievement Award: 2006
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- Contact:
I don't think it's anyone's decision whether or not they are more attracted to men or to women. Mainly because there are physical differences between certain parts of the brains of people who are attracted to women and people who are attracted to men.
-Josh
I <3 Kiwi
"The fundamental thing about music is its destiny to be broadcast or shared." -Colin Greenwood of Radiohead
I <3 Kiwi
"The fundamental thing about music is its destiny to be broadcast or shared." -Colin Greenwood of Radiohead
closeyoureyes wrote:Goodness Gracious Me.
You really don't know anything about Religion, do you. Jesus is in the NEW TESTAMENT. There was also this thing called the "Old Testament", which documents life under God from the beginning of the earth until Jesus's birth.
Jesus didn't start Religion/God, he started Christianity for those who accepted him as the Messiah/True son of God. Before, everyone was Jewish.
Also. in Genesis it is documented from the beginning of the earth, the mens births in order. I can't for the life of me remember who fathered Abraham, but he was a descendant of Adam(Obviously.), Genesis begins with Adam and Eve.
Not to take this thread off topic or anything but I have a question about Genesis. Adam and Eve were the first people on earth I understand that, and they had kids...but how did the human population grow so big then. If their kids had kids, and so forth, that wouldn't work er properly would it? So my question is...was it just them starting off the human race and theirs kids made more kids and stuff or what?
Queens Of The Stone Age-Someone's In The Wolf
Once you're lost in twillights's blue
You don't find your way, the way finds you...
Tempt the fates, beware the smile
It hides all the teeth, my dear,
What's behind them...
So glad you could stay
Forever
He steps between the trees, a crooked man
There's blood on the blade
Don't take his hand
You warm by the firelight, in twilight's blue
Shadows creep & dance the walls
He's creeping too..
So glad you could stay
Forever
<----------------- click and listen!-
Joe Cooler
Rusty wrote:closeyoureyes wrote:Goodness Gracious Me.
You really don't know anything about Religion, do you. Jesus is in the NEW TESTAMENT. There was also this thing called the "Old Testament", which documents life under God from the beginning of the earth until Jesus's birth.
Jesus didn't start Religion/God, he started Christianity for those who accepted him as the Messiah/True son of God. Before, everyone was Jewish.
Also. in Genesis it is documented from the beginning of the earth, the mens births in order. I can't for the life of me remember who fathered Abraham, but he was a descendant of Adam(Obviously.), Genesis begins with Adam and Eve.
Not to take this thread off topic or anything but I have a question about Genesis. Adam and Eve were the first people on earth I understand that, and they had kids...but how did the human population grow so big then. If their kids had kids, and so forth, that wouldn't work er properly would it? So my question is...was it just them starting off the human race and theirs kids made more kids and stuff or what?
The Bible says Adam and Eve had Cain and Abel. The Bible then says Cain "layed with his wife" and had Enoch. The Bible makes no mention of where his wife comes from so it can be assumed that God created more humans other than Adam and Eve. The Bible says Adam and Eve were the first but it no where does it say that only Adam and Eve were created without being born.
At least that's my best stab at the topic. I'm no commentator.
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Random Name
- Oskar Winner: 2007
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- Location: New Finland
You know, I never understood why the Bible has two creation stories...
They have Adam and Eve and they have God created the earth in 6 days.
I've always wondered about that.
But I'm not a religious person and I have never and have no real interst in actually reading the bible so I'm sure someone else knows about this better then I do.
They have Adam and Eve and they have God created the earth in 6 days.
I've always wondered about that.
But I'm not a religious person and I have never and have no real interst in actually reading the bible so I'm sure someone else knows about this better then I do.
-Sarah
Goodbye you liar,
Well you sipped from the cup but you don't own up to anything
Then you think you will inspire
Take apart your head
(and I wish I could inspire)
Take apart your demons, then you add it to the list.
Goodbye you liar,
Well you sipped from the cup but you don't own up to anything
Then you think you will inspire
Take apart your head
(and I wish I could inspire)
Take apart your demons, then you add it to the list.
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Joe Cooler
-
Henrietta
-
don't ask why
- Posts: 2149
- Joined: 3/14/2002, 10:28 pm
- Contact:
Bible story from what I'm familiar with is that God created the world in 6 days, 7th day he took a rest. Then he created the humans that were bound to fail 
.
now to scientifically prove:
book of relevation has 404 verses, now add the number of filipinos in the bible, multiplied by number of days left in the year, subtracted by the number of apostles at the last supper over the square root of the number of lesbians in the bible, raised to the power of the number of gays in the bible factoring in john nash's equilibrium theorem and integral calculus and multi-variable differentiation and what do you get?
you get LEFT BELOW! its the RAPTURE!
now would "gayness" or "homosexuality" be wrong if there were only two people left in the world ie. two women or just two men? hmmmm....
.
now to scientifically prove:
book of relevation has 404 verses, now add the number of filipinos in the bible, multiplied by number of days left in the year, subtracted by the number of apostles at the last supper over the square root of the number of lesbians in the bible, raised to the power of the number of gays in the bible factoring in john nash's equilibrium theorem and integral calculus and multi-variable differentiation and what do you get?
you get LEFT BELOW! its the RAPTURE!
now would "gayness" or "homosexuality" be wrong if there were only two people left in the world ie. two women or just two men? hmmmm....
When the consequence of rage comes through the living room floor.
http://seeyoufall.blogspot.com/
http://seeyoufall.blogspot.com/
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Henrietta